diff --git a/chats/handler/chats_test.go b/chats/handler/chats_test.go
index fa8a54f..3d28725 100644
--- a/chats/handler/chats_test.go
+++ b/chats/handler/chats_test.go
@@ -62,14 +62,13 @@ func assertMessagesMatch(t *testing.T, exp, act *pb.Message) {
 		return
 	}
 
-	// adapt this check so we can reuse the func in testing create, where we don't know the exact id
-	// which will be generated
+	// adapt these checks so we can reuse the func in testing create, where we don't know the exact id /
+	// idempotent_id which will be generated
 	if len(exp.Id) > 0 {
 		assert.Equal(t, exp.Id, act.Id)
 	} else {
 		assert.NotEmpty(t, act.Id)
 	}
-
 	assert.Equal(t, exp.Text, act.Text)
 	assert.Equal(t, exp.AuthorId, act.AuthorId)
 	assert.Equal(t, exp.ChatId, act.ChatId)
diff --git a/chats/handler/create_message.go b/chats/handler/create_message.go
index 9f9995e..003597a 100644
--- a/chats/handler/create_message.go
+++ b/chats/handler/create_message.go
@@ -2,6 +2,7 @@ package handler
 
 import (
 	"context"
+	"strings"
 
 	"github.com/google/uuid"
 	"github.com/micro/micro/v3/service/errors"
@@ -23,31 +24,40 @@ func (c *Chats) CreateMessage(ctx context.Context, req *pb.CreateMessageRequest,
 		return ErrMissingText
 	}
 
-	return c.DB.Transaction(func(tx *gorm.DB) error {
-		// lookup the chat
-		var conv Chat
-		if err := tx.Where(&Chat{ID: req.ChatId}).First(&conv).Error; err == gorm.ErrRecordNotFound {
-			return ErrNotFound
-		} else if err != nil {
-			logger.Errorf("Error reading chat: %v", err)
-			return errors.InternalServerError("DATABASE_ERROR", "Error connecting to database")
-		}
+	// lookup the chat
+	var conv Chat
+	if err := c.DB.Where(&Chat{ID: req.ChatId}).First(&conv).Error; err == gorm.ErrRecordNotFound {
+		return ErrNotFound
+	} else if err != nil {
+		logger.Errorf("Error reading chat: %v", err)
+		return errors.InternalServerError("DATABASE_ERROR", "Error connecting to database")
+	}
 
-		// create the message
-		msg := &Message{
-			ID:       uuid.New().String(),
-			SentAt:   c.Time(),
-			Text:     req.Text,
-			AuthorID: req.AuthorId,
-			ChatID:   req.ChatId,
-		}
-		if err := tx.Create(msg).Error; err != nil {
-			logger.Errorf("Error creating message: %v", err)
-			return errors.InternalServerError("DATABASE_ERROR", "Error connecting to database")
-		}
-
-		// serialize the response
+	// create the message
+	msg := &Message{
+		ID:       req.Id,
+		SentAt:   c.Time(),
+		Text:     req.Text,
+		AuthorID: req.AuthorId,
+		ChatID:   req.ChatId,
+	}
+	if len(msg.ID) == 0 {
+		msg.ID = uuid.New().String()
+	}
+	if err := c.DB.Create(msg).Error; err == nil {
 		rsp.Message = msg.Serialize()
 		return nil
-	})
+	} else if !strings.Contains(err.Error(), "messages_pkey") {
+		logger.Errorf("Error creating message: %v", err)
+		return errors.InternalServerError("DATABASE_ERROR", "Error connecting to database")
+	}
+
+	// a message already exists with this id
+	var existing Message
+	if err := c.DB.Where(&Message{ID: msg.ID}).First(&existing).Error; err != nil {
+		logger.Errorf("Error creating message: %v", err)
+		return errors.InternalServerError("DATABASE_ERROR", "Error connecting to database")
+	}
+	rsp.Message = existing.Serialize()
+	return nil
 }
diff --git a/chats/handler/create_message_test.go b/chats/handler/create_message_test.go
index e75c0b2..623eec1 100644
--- a/chats/handler/create_message_test.go
+++ b/chats/handler/create_message_test.go
@@ -25,12 +25,14 @@ func TestCreateMessage(t *testing.T) {
 		return
 	}
 
+	iid := uuid.New().String()
 	tt := []struct {
 		Name     string
 		AuthorID string
 		ChatID   string
 		Text     string
 		Error    error
+		ID       string
 	}{
 		{
 			Name:     "MissingChatID",
@@ -58,18 +60,35 @@ func TestCreateMessage(t *testing.T) {
 			Error:    handler.ErrNotFound,
 		},
 		{
-			Name:     "Valid",
+			Name:     "WithoutID",
 			ChatID:   cRsp.Chat.Id,
 			AuthorID: uuid.New().String(),
 			Text:     "HelloWorld",
 		},
+		{
+			Name:     "WithID",
+			ChatID:   cRsp.Chat.Id,
+			AuthorID: "johndoe",
+			Text:     "HelloWorld",
+			ID:       iid,
+		},
+		{
+			Name:     "RepeatID",
+			ChatID:   cRsp.Chat.Id,
+			AuthorID: "johndoe",
+			Text:     "HelloWorld",
+			ID:       iid,
+		},
 	}
 
 	for _, tc := range tt {
 		t.Run(tc.Name, func(t *testing.T) {
 			var rsp pb.CreateMessageResponse
 			err := h.CreateMessage(context.TODO(), &pb.CreateMessageRequest{
-				Text: tc.Text, ChatId: tc.ChatID, AuthorId: tc.AuthorID,
+				AuthorId: tc.AuthorID,
+				ChatId:   tc.ChatID,
+				Text:     tc.Text,
+				Id:       tc.ID,
 			}, &rsp)
 
 			assert.Equal(t, tc.Error, err)
@@ -83,6 +102,7 @@ func TestCreateMessage(t *testing.T) {
 				ChatId:   tc.ChatID,
 				SentAt:   timestamppb.New(h.Time()),
 				Text:     tc.Text,
+				Id:       tc.ID,
 			}, rsp.Message)
 		})
 	}
diff --git a/chats/proto/chats.pb.go b/chats/proto/chats.pb.go
index 9530c19..f035148 100644
--- a/chats/proto/chats.pb.go
+++ b/chats/proto/chats.pb.go
@@ -1,7 +1,7 @@
 // Code generated by protoc-gen-go. DO NOT EDIT.
 // versions:
-// 	protoc-gen-go v1.25.0
-// 	protoc        v3.6.1
+// 	protoc-gen-go v1.23.0
+// 	protoc        v3.13.0
 // source: proto/chats.proto
 
 package chats
@@ -268,9 +268,10 @@ type CreateMessageRequest struct {
 	sizeCache     protoimpl.SizeCache
 	unknownFields protoimpl.UnknownFields
 
-	ChatId   string `protobuf:"bytes,1,opt,name=chat_id,json=chatId,proto3" json:"chat_id,omitempty"`
-	AuthorId string `protobuf:"bytes,2,opt,name=author_id,json=authorId,proto3" json:"author_id,omitempty"`
-	Text     string `protobuf:"bytes,3,opt,name=text,proto3" json:"text,omitempty"`
+	Id       string `protobuf:"bytes,1,opt,name=id,proto3" json:"id,omitempty"`
+	ChatId   string `protobuf:"bytes,2,opt,name=chat_id,json=chatId,proto3" json:"chat_id,omitempty"`
+	AuthorId string `protobuf:"bytes,3,opt,name=author_id,json=authorId,proto3" json:"author_id,omitempty"`
+	Text     string `protobuf:"bytes,4,opt,name=text,proto3" json:"text,omitempty"`
 }
 
 func (x *CreateMessageRequest) Reset() {
@@ -305,6 +306,13 @@ func (*CreateMessageRequest) Descriptor() ([]byte, []int) {
 	return file_proto_chats_proto_rawDescGZIP(), []int{4}
 }
 
+func (x *CreateMessageRequest) GetId() string {
+	if x != nil {
+		return x.Id
+	}
+	return ""
+}
+
 func (x *CreateMessageRequest) GetChatId() string {
 	if x != nil {
 		return x.ChatId
@@ -514,13 +522,14 @@ var file_proto_chats_proto_rawDesc = []byte{
 	0x72, 0x49, 0x64, 0x73, 0x22, 0x35, 0x0a, 0x12, 0x43, 0x72, 0x65, 0x61, 0x74, 0x65, 0x43, 0x68,
 	0x61, 0x74, 0x52, 0x65, 0x73, 0x70, 0x6f, 0x6e, 0x73, 0x65, 0x12, 0x1f, 0x0a, 0x04, 0x63, 0x68,
 	0x61, 0x74, 0x18, 0x01, 0x20, 0x01, 0x28, 0x0b, 0x32, 0x0b, 0x2e, 0x63, 0x68, 0x61, 0x74, 0x73,
-	0x2e, 0x43, 0x68, 0x61, 0x74, 0x52, 0x04, 0x63, 0x68, 0x61, 0x74, 0x22, 0x60, 0x0a, 0x14, 0x43,
+	0x2e, 0x43, 0x68, 0x61, 0x74, 0x52, 0x04, 0x63, 0x68, 0x61, 0x74, 0x22, 0x70, 0x0a, 0x14, 0x43,
 	0x72, 0x65, 0x61, 0x74, 0x65, 0x4d, 0x65, 0x73, 0x73, 0x61, 0x67, 0x65, 0x52, 0x65, 0x71, 0x75,
-	0x65, 0x73, 0x74, 0x12, 0x17, 0x0a, 0x07, 0x63, 0x68, 0x61, 0x74, 0x5f, 0x69, 0x64, 0x18, 0x01,
+	0x65, 0x73, 0x74, 0x12, 0x0e, 0x0a, 0x02, 0x69, 0x64, 0x18, 0x01, 0x20, 0x01, 0x28, 0x09, 0x52,
+	0x02, 0x69, 0x64, 0x12, 0x17, 0x0a, 0x07, 0x63, 0x68, 0x61, 0x74, 0x5f, 0x69, 0x64, 0x18, 0x02,
 	0x20, 0x01, 0x28, 0x09, 0x52, 0x06, 0x63, 0x68, 0x61, 0x74, 0x49, 0x64, 0x12, 0x1b, 0x0a, 0x09,
-	0x61, 0x75, 0x74, 0x68, 0x6f, 0x72, 0x5f, 0x69, 0x64, 0x18, 0x02, 0x20, 0x01, 0x28, 0x09, 0x52,
+	0x61, 0x75, 0x74, 0x68, 0x6f, 0x72, 0x5f, 0x69, 0x64, 0x18, 0x03, 0x20, 0x01, 0x28, 0x09, 0x52,
 	0x08, 0x61, 0x75, 0x74, 0x68, 0x6f, 0x72, 0x49, 0x64, 0x12, 0x12, 0x0a, 0x04, 0x74, 0x65, 0x78,
-	0x74, 0x18, 0x03, 0x20, 0x01, 0x28, 0x09, 0x52, 0x04, 0x74, 0x65, 0x78, 0x74, 0x22, 0x41, 0x0a,
+	0x74, 0x18, 0x04, 0x20, 0x01, 0x28, 0x09, 0x52, 0x04, 0x74, 0x65, 0x78, 0x74, 0x22, 0x41, 0x0a,
 	0x15, 0x43, 0x72, 0x65, 0x61, 0x74, 0x65, 0x4d, 0x65, 0x73, 0x73, 0x61, 0x67, 0x65, 0x52, 0x65,
 	0x73, 0x70, 0x6f, 0x6e, 0x73, 0x65, 0x12, 0x28, 0x0a, 0x07, 0x6d, 0x65, 0x73, 0x73, 0x61, 0x67,
 	0x65, 0x18, 0x01, 0x20, 0x01, 0x28, 0x0b, 0x32, 0x0e, 0x2e, 0x63, 0x68, 0x61, 0x74, 0x73, 0x2e,
diff --git a/chats/proto/chats.proto b/chats/proto/chats.proto
index 8c24643..2da9b87 100644
--- a/chats/proto/chats.proto
+++ b/chats/proto/chats.proto
@@ -39,9 +39,10 @@ message CreateChatResponse {
 }
 
 message CreateMessageRequest {
-	string chat_id = 1;
-	string author_id = 2;
-	string text = 3;
+	string id = 1;
+	string chat_id = 2;
+	string author_id = 3;
+	string text = 4;
 }
 
 message CreateMessageResponse {
diff --git a/threads/handler/create_message.go b/threads/handler/create_message.go
index aec5a5a..a03a492 100644
--- a/threads/handler/create_message.go
+++ b/threads/handler/create_message.go
@@ -2,6 +2,7 @@ package handler
 
 import (
 	"context"
+	"strings"
 
 	"github.com/google/uuid"
 	"github.com/micro/micro/v3/service/errors"
@@ -23,31 +24,40 @@ func (s *Threads) CreateMessage(ctx context.Context, req *pb.CreateMessageReques
 		return ErrMissingText
 	}
 
-	return s.DB.Transaction(func(tx *gorm.DB) error {
-		// lookup the conversation
-		var conv Conversation
-		if err := tx.Where(&Conversation{ID: req.ConversationId}).First(&conv).Error; err == gorm.ErrRecordNotFound {
-			return ErrNotFound
-		} else if err != nil {
-			logger.Errorf("Error reading conversation: %v", err)
-			return errors.InternalServerError("DATABASE_ERROR", "Error connecting to database")
-		}
+	// lookup the conversation
+	var conv Conversation
+	if err := s.DB.Where(&Conversation{ID: req.ConversationId}).First(&conv).Error; err == gorm.ErrRecordNotFound {
+		return ErrNotFound
+	} else if err != nil {
+		logger.Errorf("Error reading conversation: %v", err)
+		return errors.InternalServerError("DATABASE_ERROR", "Error connecting to database")
+	}
 
-		// create the message
-		msg := &Message{
-			ID:             uuid.New().String(),
-			SentAt:         s.Time(),
-			Text:           req.Text,
-			AuthorID:       req.AuthorId,
-			ConversationID: req.ConversationId,
-		}
-		if err := tx.Create(msg).Error; err != nil {
-			logger.Errorf("Error creating message: %v", err)
-			return errors.InternalServerError("DATABASE_ERROR", "Error connecting to database")
-		}
-
-		// serialize the response
+	// create the message
+	msg := &Message{
+		ID:             req.Id,
+		SentAt:         s.Time(),
+		Text:           req.Text,
+		AuthorID:       req.AuthorId,
+		ConversationID: req.ConversationId,
+	}
+	if len(msg.ID) == 0 {
+		msg.ID = uuid.New().String()
+	}
+	if err := s.DB.Create(msg).Error; err == nil {
 		rsp.Message = msg.Serialize()
 		return nil
-	})
+	} else if !strings.Contains(err.Error(), "messages_pkey") {
+		logger.Errorf("Error creating message: %v", err)
+		return errors.InternalServerError("DATABASE_ERROR", "Error connecting to database")
+	}
+
+	// a message already exists with this id
+	var existing Message
+	if err := s.DB.Where(&Message{ID: msg.ID}).First(&existing).Error; err != nil {
+		logger.Errorf("Error creating message: %v", err)
+		return errors.InternalServerError("DATABASE_ERROR", "Error connecting to database")
+	}
+	rsp.Message = existing.Serialize()
+	return nil
 }
diff --git a/threads/handler/create_message_test.go b/threads/handler/create_message_test.go
index b72f530..5bfea50 100644
--- a/threads/handler/create_message_test.go
+++ b/threads/handler/create_message_test.go
@@ -25,10 +25,12 @@ func TestCreateMessage(t *testing.T) {
 		return
 	}
 
+	iid := uuid.New().String()
 	tt := []struct {
 		Name           string
 		AuthorID       string
 		ConversationID string
+		ID             string
 		Text           string
 		Error          error
 	}{
@@ -58,18 +60,35 @@ func TestCreateMessage(t *testing.T) {
 			Error:          handler.ErrNotFound,
 		},
 		{
-			Name:           "Valid",
+			Name:           "NoID",
 			ConversationID: cRsp.Conversation.Id,
 			AuthorID:       uuid.New().String(),
 			Text:           "HelloWorld",
 		},
+		{
+			Name:           "WithID",
+			ConversationID: cRsp.Conversation.Id,
+			Text:           "HelloWorld",
+			AuthorID:       "johndoe",
+			ID:             iid,
+		},
+		{
+			Name:           "RepeatID",
+			ConversationID: cRsp.Conversation.Id,
+			Text:           "HelloWorld",
+			AuthorID:       "johndoe",
+			ID:             iid,
+		},
 	}
 
 	for _, tc := range tt {
 		t.Run(tc.Name, func(t *testing.T) {
 			var rsp pb.CreateMessageResponse
 			err := h.CreateMessage(context.TODO(), &pb.CreateMessageRequest{
-				Text: tc.Text, ConversationId: tc.ConversationID, AuthorId: tc.AuthorID,
+				AuthorId:       tc.AuthorID,
+				ConversationId: tc.ConversationID,
+				Text:           tc.Text,
+				Id:             tc.ID,
 			}, &rsp)
 
 			assert.Equal(t, tc.Error, err)
@@ -79,6 +98,7 @@ func TestCreateMessage(t *testing.T) {
 			}
 
 			assertMessagesMatch(t, &pb.Message{
+				Id:             tc.ID,
 				AuthorId:       tc.AuthorID,
 				ConversationId: tc.ConversationID,
 				SentAt:         timestamppb.New(h.Time()),
diff --git a/threads/proto/threads.pb.go b/threads/proto/threads.pb.go
index b3bdfb5..afabab8 100644
--- a/threads/proto/threads.pb.go
+++ b/threads/proto/threads.pb.go
@@ -1,7 +1,7 @@
 // Code generated by protoc-gen-go. DO NOT EDIT.
 // versions:
-// 	protoc-gen-go v1.25.0
-// 	protoc        v3.6.1
+// 	protoc-gen-go v1.23.0
+// 	protoc        v3.13.0
 // source: proto/threads.proto
 
 package threads
@@ -667,9 +667,10 @@ type CreateMessageRequest struct {
 	sizeCache     protoimpl.SizeCache
 	unknownFields protoimpl.UnknownFields
 
-	ConversationId string `protobuf:"bytes,1,opt,name=conversation_id,json=conversationId,proto3" json:"conversation_id,omitempty"`
-	AuthorId       string `protobuf:"bytes,2,opt,name=author_id,json=authorId,proto3" json:"author_id,omitempty"`
-	Text           string `protobuf:"bytes,3,opt,name=text,proto3" json:"text,omitempty"`
+	Id             string `protobuf:"bytes,1,opt,name=id,proto3" json:"id,omitempty"`
+	ConversationId string `protobuf:"bytes,2,opt,name=conversation_id,json=conversationId,proto3" json:"conversation_id,omitempty"`
+	AuthorId       string `protobuf:"bytes,3,opt,name=author_id,json=authorId,proto3" json:"author_id,omitempty"`
+	Text           string `protobuf:"bytes,4,opt,name=text,proto3" json:"text,omitempty"`
 }
 
 func (x *CreateMessageRequest) Reset() {
@@ -704,6 +705,13 @@ func (*CreateMessageRequest) Descriptor() ([]byte, []int) {
 	return file_proto_threads_proto_rawDescGZIP(), []int{12}
 }
 
+func (x *CreateMessageRequest) GetId() string {
+	if x != nil {
+		return x.Id
+	}
+	return ""
+}
+
 func (x *CreateMessageRequest) GetConversationId() string {
 	if x != nil {
 		return x.ConversationId
@@ -1058,94 +1066,95 @@ var file_proto_threads_proto_rawDesc = []byte{
 	0x65, 0x73, 0x74, 0x12, 0x0e, 0x0a, 0x02, 0x69, 0x64, 0x18, 0x01, 0x20, 0x01, 0x28, 0x09, 0x52,
 	0x02, 0x69, 0x64, 0x22, 0x1c, 0x0a, 0x1a, 0x44, 0x65, 0x6c, 0x65, 0x74, 0x65, 0x43, 0x6f, 0x6e,
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-	0x12, 0x27, 0x0a, 0x0f, 0x63, 0x6f, 0x6e, 0x76, 0x65, 0x72, 0x73, 0x61, 0x74, 0x69, 0x6f, 0x6e,
-	0x5f, 0x69, 0x64, 0x18, 0x01, 0x20, 0x01, 0x28, 0x09, 0x52, 0x0e, 0x63, 0x6f, 0x6e, 0x76, 0x65,
-	0x72, 0x73, 0x61, 0x74, 0x69, 0x6f, 0x6e, 0x49, 0x64, 0x12, 0x3b, 0x0a, 0x0b, 0x73, 0x65, 0x6e,
-	0x74, 0x5f, 0x62, 0x65, 0x66, 0x6f, 0x72, 0x65, 0x18, 0x02, 0x20, 0x01, 0x28, 0x0b, 0x32, 0x1a,
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 }
 
 var (
diff --git a/threads/proto/threads.proto b/threads/proto/threads.proto
index ffde7e0..1ec624e 100644
--- a/threads/proto/threads.proto
+++ b/threads/proto/threads.proto
@@ -84,9 +84,10 @@ message DeleteConversationRequest {
 message DeleteConversationResponse {}
 
 message CreateMessageRequest {
-	string conversation_id = 1;
-	string author_id = 2;
-	string text = 3;
+	string id = 1;
+	string conversation_id = 2;
+	string author_id = 3;
+	string text = 4;
 }
 
 message CreateMessageResponse {